Subtech Downpipe Review

[Scotte]

Interesting article about cat vs. catless exhaust

http://www.importtuner.com/features/0610impp_catalytic_converter_removal/viewall.html

[pl0x]

 Scotte said:

Interesting article about cat vs. catless exhaust

http://www.importtuner.com/features/0610impp_catalytic_converter_removal/viewall.html

in a Honda - non turbo... huge difference to turbo cars

also every Honda driver I know says Honda's like/need back pressure

[Scotte]

Like i said earlier, no noticeable drop in power, power actually feels smoother and because its not a shit sound any more you can use more of it.

[Heylin]

Anyone have any idea if its worth replacing just the cat with a quality resonator ? would it be raspy ? and coupled with an ECU-Reflash would there be any benefit ?

I too am looking at the subtech pipe for a little extra zoom, but dont want to lose the lovely quiet ride so i can enjoy my mcintosh sounds.

Mabey I should just reflash stock and be happy ?.

Will be selling the car befor it hits 100,000kms so dont need to worry about cats getting clogged up or breaking apart.

[ADIKT]

 Heylin said:

Anyone have any idea if its worth replacing just the cat with a quality resonator ? would it be raspy ? and coupled with an ECU-Reflash would there be any benefit ?

I too am looking at the subtech pipe for a little extra zoom, but dont want to lose the lovely quiet ride so i can enjoy my mcintosh sounds.

Mabey I should just reflash stock and be happy ?.

Will be selling the car befor it hits 100,000kms so dont need to worry about cats getting clogged up or breaking apart.

Turn your stereo up louder!!!! lol

[Heylin]

LOL those days are gone, ive just sold my highly modified Toyota MR2.

Looking to get the legacy doing a sensible 220 kw at the engine but not lose the nice factory quiet ride.

Up pipe seems like alot of hassle and $500

Front pipe will be about $600 but needs further work to reduce noise

and either way im up for $800 for an ECU reflash

Really thinking ECU flash on stock may just be the sensible thing to dom but part of me still likes to dick around with stock things. LOL

[Scotte]

Would be a big job trying to cut the cats out of the stock downpipe i reckon, unless your mechanically minded i wouldn't attempt to take off the downpipe myself.

Its really a complicated downpipe and you'd be lucky to get some other part welded in there. By the way there are actually two cats in the factory downpipe.

Stock pipe can be seen here:

http://www.scoobytuner.com/tuning/?tSfID1=9&tuningID=93

Most of the restriction comes from the tiny entrance to the stock pipe, you can see from that pic how small the entrance of the stock pipe is. The subtech pipe has a second hole (and pipe) to allow the waste gates gases to flow freely, allowing the car to come on boost quicker.

It all depends how much power you want.

Tune = more power

Tune + downpipe = even more power.

I'm happy with my downpipe setup now (and sound) and will get a tune in the near future.

I was a bit disappointed that subtech weren't more upfront about how s*** the sound from the downpipe is.

A good video here about downpipes:

[Heylin]

If you had to choose between the Subtech Downpipe and Perrin Up Pipe as first exhaust mod which one would you pick ?

[ADIKT]

 Heylin said:

If you had to choose between the Subtech Downpipe and Perrin Up Pipe as first exhaust mod which one would you pick ?

downpipe!!

[funkytown]

 ADIKT']

[quote name='Heylin said:

If you had to choose between the Subtech Downpipe and Perrin Up Pipe as first exhaust mod which one would you pick ?

/quote]

downpipe!!

definately. There is no need to change the factory uppipe at all.

[Scotte]

Downpipe. Think the factory up-pipe is catless anyway.

[Heylin]

2004 Legacy GT Spec B - thought they had cat in the factory up pipe ? hence Perrin making a catless up pipe for that model.

[funkytown]

 Heylin said:

2004 Legacy GT Spec B - thought they had cat in the factory up pipe ? hence Perrin making a catless up pipe for that model.

i would pick it doesnt have a cat there, what they do have from factory is a flexi half way up, but in factory configuration they are quite useful and should remain. And they dont reduce power by any measurable amount.

[ADIKT]

 Heylin said:

2004 Legacy GT Spec B - thought they had cat in the factory up pipe ? hence Perrin making a catless up pipe for that model.

Youl prob find that some of the USDM legacys came with an up pipe with a cat in it.. a doubt the JDM and NZDM will.

[Heylin]

Good to know, would explain how the Subtech pipe gets such good results, if there was a Cat in up pipe then flow would still be impeded.

So based on that the $$ I save on the up pipe should go into a resonator or 2 in exhaust system to make up for lack of a cat.

Hate raspy exhausts.

[ADIKT]

 Heylin said:

Good to know, would explain how the Subtech pipe gets such good results, if there was a Cat in up pipe then flow would still be impeded.

So based on that the $$ I save on the up pipe should go into a resonator or 2 in exhaust system to make up for lack of a cat.

Hate raspy exhausts.

Yes. If you want to confirm for peace of mind. While the DP i getting done you could have a peek at the up pipe.

[Heylin]

Just been to Jegs.com seem to have good prices shipped to NZ on exhaust components.

Magnaflow high flow oval cat for $250NZ shipped. Thats about on par with what id be paying for a resonator.

Also looking at Adrenalin R NZ in Hastings for a custom resonator, they did a couple of custom 6" cans for my MR2 system. 3" from mufflers to turbo and short mid engine pipes and it wasnt much louder than stock, great work.

So im pretty much decided on

- Subtech front pipe with a resonator (or high flow cat) + reflash, Dave at NZ Performance Tuning seems to be best price at $780, how come Subtech charge $1144 ? do you get a better tune ?.

[funkytown]

just for what its worth. We generally call it downpipes, not front pipes.

[ADIKT]

 Heylin said:

Just been to Jegs.com seem to have good prices shipped to NZ on exhaust components.

Magnaflow high flow oval cat for $250NZ shipped. Thats about on par with what id be paying for a resonator.

Also looking at Adrenalin R NZ in Hastings for a custom resonator, they did a couple of custom 6" cans for my MR2 system. 3" from mufflers to turbo and short mid engine pipes and it wasnt much louder than stock, great work.

So im pretty much decided on

- Subtech front pipe with a resonator (or high flow cat) + reflash, Dave at NZ Performance Tuning seems to be best price at $780, how come Subtech charge $1144 ? do you get a better tune ?.

i would go with a reso in it not a high flow cart. And subtech dont have a dyno to do a reflash on? i would take it to Garry capper. as we have already seen proof that he can do a good reflash on a leggy GT

[Heylin]

Yeah I called Gary, apprently they will need the car for 2 days, living in Hamilton, having one car and a baby doesnt really allow for me to drop it off there, as much as id like Gary to tune it and their price was good at $995 as well (dyno and road tune)

Actually is there anyone in Hamilton that has the ability to reflash ? or is all the talent in Auckland ?

[ADIKT]

Did you try explain your circumstances to him? hes a good dude

[Heylin]

 ADIKT said:

Did you try explain your circumstances to him? hes a good dude

Nah didnt want to be a hassle, would involve using a courtesy car (if they had one) and taking a few hours annual leave to drop off and pick up.

Best scenario for me would be for subtech to do the lot, but at $1144 for a tune id rather just have the pipe courier, get it all installed down here in Hamilton and sort out tuning later.

Thinking about it all now, I realise why modifying is such a costly hassle and mabey I should just not do anything to the car.

[ADIKT]

 Heylin']

[quote name='ADIKT said:

Did you try explain your circumstances to him? hes a good dude

/quote]

Nah didnt want to be a hassle, would involve using a courtesy car (if they had one) and taking a few hours annual leave to drop off and pick up.

Best scenario for me would be for subtech to do the lot, but at $1144 for a tune id rather just have the pipe courier, get it all installed down here in Hamilton and sort out tuning later.

Thinking about it all now, I realise why modifying is such a costly hassle and mabey I should just not do anything to the car.

Id get the Downpipe and get it installed.. then when youve got some more spare time and money go get a reflash done..

[Scotte]

Yeah i don't think Subtech do a Dyno Tune, road tune only. Defo want the Dyno tune if you go that way in the end.

Don't think you need a tune straight away, so if you want to keep the cost down do the downpipe and then save for a tune later.

Be aware driving catless makes your car a whole lot smellier too. Some people here probably think im a greenie, but i hated the smell when pulling into my garage, sitting at the lights idling with the windows down or someone getting stuff out the car while idling, was pretty smelly to me. Is much better with a cat in the system. I've got a kid to drive round too so don't want to fill his lungs with poisons etc.

As to whether you should just leave as is, sleep on it. Let it brew in the mind. Do some more research and make a decision later. But you will always be wondering "can this car go better?"

[Heylin]

 Scotte said:

Yeah i don't think Subtech do a Dyno Tune, road tune only. Defo want the Dyno tune if you go that way in the end.

Don't think you need a tune straight away, so if you want to keep the cost down do the downpipe and then save for a tune later.

Be aware driving catless makes your car a whole lot smellier too. Some people here probably think im a greenie, but i hated the smell when pulling into my garage, sitting at the lights idling with the windows down or someone getting stuff out the car while idling, was pretty smelly to me. Is much better with a cat in the system. I've got a kid to drive round too so don't want to fill his lungs with poisons etc.

As to whether you should just leave as is, sleep on it. Let it brew in the mind. Do some more research and make a decision later. But you will always be wondering "can this car go better?"

Good call on the health factor there, are they really that smelly and bad without cats ? ? my MR2 Turbo is catless and I drive it tops out and all and never noticed it, also idle it for ages in the garage while warming it up.