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New pistons into CDB EJ20


Jono24

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Hi Guys,

I picked up a CDB EJ20 for 50 bucks a couple of years ago. Just recently I have finished dismantling completely and found one piston has a broken ringland.

It is an older cast piston and the engine block cylinder walls look OK. I can't see any scratching other then helical (hone?) marks.

Can I just buy a second-hand set of pistons and chuck em in, or do I really need to get it looked at by a machinist/engine builder?

Can I fit some newer HF type pistons in? and with or without machine work.

I've seen a guy selling a set of 3 CP pistons on TM which look to be 2.1L stroker pistons but are mislabelled, he hasn't gotten back to me on the SKU code to even see if I can buy a 4th piston or for how much.

A 2.1L really does appeal, but not at new prices. This will be an learning exercise so I don't want to spend a bucket load and it all go pear shaped because I forgot/missed doing something properly.

Some guidance here would be much appreciated. The plan is to fit my twin scroll parts to it so I won't be needing a 600hp build here.

Here is the list of parts I have to put together to make my frankenstein to give you a picture to process of what I might need.

EJ20 CDB, original crank/rods appear ok, main bearings look good but don't mind replacing these.

BE/BH heads - need a skim, there is also surface corrosion on the cam lobes, should i be concerned about this?

Twin scroll sump, headers, VF37 turbo

BE/BH intake manifold, injector, throttle body ...

I'm not against changing some of the internals (i.e. for a phase 2 crank/rods), but not if it's going to cripple my budget.

Cheers,

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Well what bore size is marked on the block (all B?) first you have to strip the block,

check crank journals you can run early crank and there is nothing wrong with strength but the oil ports etc aren't machined out very well they got better through the years.

Throw away the rods and invest in some forged h beams with new arp bolts or find some v7 sti rods

I've got a set of hf pistons from v5 sti block that are good to reuse you can buy them from me(pm if interested) if you want/going this way. If your building a engine something over 20psi then you might want to go full forged. factory pistons are still a weak point but obviously cheaper option.

You real need to measure everything, the bores especially, remember they need de-glazing and machine shop is able to do this best(ie won't tapper the bores.. So thats when you should start thinking about new .50 oversized pistons new rings and bores machined to suit but obviously the safer option is always the most costly but most practical

If its just surface rust on the cam lobes clean it up with metal polish if its pitted use some engine oil and wet and dry 320g sandpaper.

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Hey Hijacka,

The CDB is BBBB (block stamps matches the pistons, I checked).

I'll PM you on the pistons, any ideas on the value of v7 rods?

I'll take the block in to get it cleaned and checked. I've had a price from Mace to check the bores and give it a hone but there is also an engine builder on Hills road (end of Bealey ave) someone at work mentioned, anywhere else in chch you'd ask for a price (or run from?).

I read elsewhere that for the 2.5l pistons the B size is smaller than the A size, is this true for the 2.0l pistons? (i.e. i have wiggle room to lose a bit of bore material to run A size pistons)

The cam lobes aren't pitted, I gave them a bit of a clean the other night and they came up alright, a little bit more polishing and you'd never know.

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I think the A and B refer to what size piston was used(will be 0.xx mm difference) and has to match or be rebored to suit new pistons.

Rods probably a couple hundy. Try SAS or fbssub or marc for these.

Hijacka nailed it pretty good. Unless the block is mint you might want to think about going oversize piston and machined bores. It really depends how much you wanna spend and how much power you wanna push...

If you're looking for a builder I would contact SAS (richard) on here. He's the go to guy for most of us when it comes to technical stuff like building engines.

Others might disagree with me here but you can re-use subaru head studs.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Anyone got any tips on whether to keep the EJ208 heads I got or go to some newer AVCS heads for this build? (I understand avcs needs a capable ecu.)

Can someone also give me a quick ranking of the top (approx)5 heads as i hear alot of people talk about v3 heads and I'm curious why these may be better/stronger/simpler?

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  • 4 weeks later...

So I got some (cheap and new) forged pistons which are 92mm, and I have some late model rods.

My centre thrust crank has ground out the no.3 rod bearing surface when it died the first time so I'm pretty sure I need another crank.

I've seen Mace engineering and HPE advertise they can do the machine work, anyone else you'd recommend or avoid?

I think I'll be happy enough to stick with a centre thrust crank, I just need to take the block halves in to see if they are in good enough condition to get away with the 92mm pistons I have.

Does anyone know where to get a seal kit for the short block rebuild cheaply, or the part numbers for partsouq?

Cheers,

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I would stay away from hpe, Long story but Gavin is a toss pot basically. You can get the block machined and decked at hills road engine reconditioners, Russell is good guy to deal with and another name that springs to mind is Peter at Kenelley Cams for anything above the block just on battersea st up from hpe.

The problem with a old block and 92mm pistons is by the time you machine the bores out the piston to wall clearance might be out and or ring gap to large so you might be up for new os pistons or sleeve the block.. i've got a centre thrust crank here you can have it for 100 if you want

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If your dropping in block halves then you need to supply the pistons and rings so they can check clearances and make sure its not tapered etc.You might get away with a deglaze but again it depends. Its also a good idea to drop in the crank to get it checked same time Russell will be happy to check it suitability so then you know if you should need standard bearings or not.

In most cases you would order a set of piston 0.50mm oversized so you have room to machine or standard size sleeve with standard size pistons will do it.

But you won't know till you drop it off

Edited by hijacka
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So, I dropped off the block halves, pistons, rods and crank to the engine shop on hills road.

Russell said the block was ok for the pistons, and I'll get away with a hone.

Picking up the seals for between the block halves from Armstrong's tomorrow and the process begins. Russell also reckons I can reuse the old crank with a regrind.

All good news so far.

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Here's a look at the pistons I have, on the left are the original pistons out of the cdb, in the middle are v3/4 HF pistons, and on the right are my new Wossner pistons.

DSC_06871_zps40nzdmgb.jpg

DSC_06911_zpsa63okd5q.jpg

DSC_06891_zpseczi48n1.jpg

One of the original pistons broke the ringland and ran the bigend on the number 3 cylinder.

DSC_06931_zpsrk0liabg.jpg

so the cost of my rebuilt shortblock (so far) has come to $1550 and includes:

Complete shortblock: $50

V7+ Subaru Rods: $175

Wossner pistons (new): $395

Machine work, bearings, labour: $896 (ready to assemble, bearing tolerances set, rings gapped, block dipped and skimmed...)

Oil seals between block halves: $35 (4 of from Armstrongs, and crank oil seal)

Still to purchase:

Oil pick up

Oil pump

Water pump

I'll post some pics when I get the block back at the end of next week. The $896 doesn't include final assembly, this is something i wanted to do myself and it would add to the zero budget i have anyway.

Edited by Jono24
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Some pics of the assembly:

Crank and rods assembled, torqued to 45Nm (from BE/BH FSM), and with the Fuji logo's facing forward on the rods:

DSC_07001_zpsupjaeqda.jpg

Bearing shells in block:

DSC_07021_zpshilnp1fs.jpg

O rings in:

DSC_07031_zps37mump3e.jpg

Crank and rods dropped into block:

DSC_07041_zpskx0aspuy.jpg

Ready for gasket seal:

DSC_07051_zpspdlorlri.jpg

Gasket seal done and second block half on:

DSC_07141_zpsczxkpuir.jpg

I watched the following video a few times to figure out exactly what i was doing, it was very helpful and showed me some of the finer points i would've completely missed otherwise.

Something I didn't look to hard for was torque settings for the oil squirters. I was s*** scared I was gonna strip the threads on these, and set the torque wrench to 15Nm but chickened out before I got there. Next it tried 10Nm and then 7Nm, in the end I did them by feel due to fear of making a mess of them.

I couldn't even torque up the block bolts as the perimeter block bolts got left behind at the machine shop, so gonna have to wait to finish this off.

Edited by Jono24
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Found the rest of the bolts... laying in my garage all bagged up.

The block bolts are all in and torqued up using the values from the Suabru Legacy BE/BH FSM.

You can't get to all of them with a torque wrench so had to 'feel' a couple.

Pistons in and baffle on the sump:

DSC_07151_zpsmjjuhrmo.jpg

Got a ring compressor from Butler Automart for $34, Supercheap wanted $45 for the same thing with a Stanley brand on it and Trade Tools have one for $23, but aren't open Sunday.

You can hire them from Butler for $15 day though... I'll probably never use mine again but didn't see the value in the hire fee and then having to drive back to return it.

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