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Why the hype?


G B

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Noticed there is a lot of hype and excitement on a US STi forum about the new Civic Type R. Some people have even alluded to swapping their STi for one.

Ok, 228kW and 400Nm sounds impressive and while it does have trick suspension, it is still a FWD car. 

Now, I'll agree that it does look like a nice car and has its place in the market, but it certainly won't handle or perform like the latest STi and it amuses me how some are literally drooling over it.

Interestingly tbere were a few a while back stating how good the Focus RS is going to be. They've gone quiet about that now xD

 

And talking of the Focus RS. Apart from the 2 I've seen in showdooms, not seen any around at all. Anyone seen any out and about?

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The Type R would out handle our cars. A good mate of mine has a EP3 Type R that has a 2.4L bottom end stuck to a 2.0L Type R top end and it's making the same power as our car's but it's still N/A. His car out handles mine in corners and it's around 13 years older than mine. As for the Focus RS, they have been a bit of a flop. They run the same 1/4 mile as a 2015 STi but have more power and more torque. They emphasised "Drift mode" when the DCCD system in the STi is capable of the same thing.


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Always interesting to read features like the Dual axis suspension set up to deal with torque steer. Would be interesting to see how well it deals with 300hp through the front wheels.

I remember seeing a Jeremy Clarkson review of the Focus RS and while it was good it still had bad torques steer, the computers and suspension set up still couldn't handle the power 

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i think its hyped in the US because it's a really big deal for them to get a USDM Type R after maybe 15 years since the old integra type r stopped.

 

after getting my Subaru , i quickly realised i was getting sucked in to a bit of a cult (not that it's a bad thing). you get in to the community , you learn about your own car and those of your mates and you end up loving Subaru through all those bonds. wouldn't have it any other way, atleast not for a while, for us the STI badge is something quite special (though we are outnumbered by Legacy owners so maybe not on this forum haha) and for Honda guys that's the Type R.. i imagine the honda crowd being much the same as us, just a bit more hype due to bigger fanbase especially consisting of the younger people.

 

my opinion is that it looks very relevant for the target market, super aggressive but probably will be extremely outdated looking 5 years later. its priced in that similar bracket (atleast from a quick google search) to the 2018 STI at around 40k USD so i'll be curious to see how many takers there will be... not sure why anyone is considering swapping their STI for one of these though! either they just hopped on the hype bandwagon or considering it for the opportunities to monetise via youtube vlogs etc... or maybe they weren't true blooded STI enthusiasts lol.

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17 minutes ago, Batbaruman said:

not sure why anyone is considering swapping their STI for one of these though! either they just hopped on the hype bandwagon or considering it for the opportunities to monetise via youtube vlogs etc... or maybe they weren't true blooded STI enthusiasts lol.

Its interesting to read the US forums, as they have had to have had a bit of an issue with the new engines (well according to some people) and many are saying they don't trust the longevity of the engines and may with to other brands.

Not sure why you would want to swap a AWD to FWD but it does look like a good car and will have a real fan base over in the states (more so than Subaru).

Personally I'll stick with Subaru

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I thought the appeal of Honda was their N/A engines made good power in the high-end and were low cost, lightweight momentum racers.

 

If they are now turbo what makes them different from other cars?

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I went shopping for a new daily 6 months ago and it came down to a 2010 sti or a gen 2 mps a NZ new car. 

 

After test driving both, I choose the mps, it was basically a far nicer car inside and out and yes that means  I choose a FWD over AWD. The Subaru really felt cheap compared to it. A mate of mine also bought one around the same time and he too choose the mps over the Subaru. 

Edited by Username
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I'd never go to another brand car now that ive gone so far with my old banga

But i'd be lying if I said hondas dont build good cars

+ Their motorbikes are F***ing great 

 

This new car looks new car-ish

So it will never appeal to the likes of me :) I like my car with at least 3 dents / worn out / 200,000kms at least :) 

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2 hours ago, G B said:

 

That is a bold statement to make.

 

not hyperbole.

 

for best handling, two wheel drive beats awd.

 

in an evo magazine test the old fk2 civic type r was just as fast as a focus rs awd around the track.

and the discontinued renault megane rs275 trophy r is still the best handling hot hatch.

 

seen a few focus rs on the road but they are easily out-numbered by the new mustang - every man and his dog seems to have one.

 

the new civic type r is pretty fugly but you don't notice from the inside.

it will have strong competition from the new seat leon cupra to be launched in nz later this year - same 221kw motor as a golf r, fwd, lsd, only $57k !

 

 

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Coming from owning and building quite a few Honda's in the past they always appealed to me that it was a car you could commute to work in day to day then shed weight and take it to the track on the weekend. You knew that you were going to get smoked down the straight but it's nimbleness would let you reel cars in on the corners. They are such a fun car to have as an entry level track / daily.

 

I feel that Honda have taken that away from themselves with this build, going into a car that has  all these expensive panels to replace as well as the stress of a turbo on their high RPM motor then adding tones of electronically powered gadgets which are an added hassle to fix if your going to be beating it up on a track. The previous Hondas I have owned are more basic and parts are easy and cheapish to get so you can push them as much as need be on the track however I would be nervous in the new one to break it haha.

 

I love my WRX though after testing plenty of cars I wouldn't go to anything else at this stage

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The limit is going to be much higher on an AWD compared to FWD obviously, but understeer is going to  be easier to deal with for the average driver. Probably why the current STi is set up to understeer when pushed really hard. FWD does have its place and you will obviously get more power to the wheels, but unequal lengh driveshafts are always going to be the achilles heel as far as torque steer is concerned.  And once you start getting up there, AWD is going to give you better grip than FWD ever can.

I used to have a Rover 220 GTi which ran 13 sec 1/4 mile but no way would it get anywhere near an STi on the twisties.

I get that Honda do nice n/a motors and quality builds, but feel they have gone thx turbo route to get higher outputs as those figures tend to sell cars at the end of the day.

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not obvious at all...

 

remember the little renault clio rs197 ?

on a skidpan that could pull the same g's as a porsche 996 carrera 4.

absolute limits mean little on the road.

 

back in 2001 motor magazine australia compared three under $40k performance cars with different drivetrains -  fwd dc2 integra type r, awd v7 bugeye wrx, rwd nissan s15 200sx.

fastest car point-to-point, in the wet was...

the dc2 type r.

 

some awd may have higher limits but going over the limit usually results in spikey, non-progressive behaviour.

if you look at cars where there is a 2wd and awd version offered, it is often the 2wd that is considered the drivers car.

for legislative and marketing reasons, with few exceptions, the turbo route is now the primary course for high performance powertrains.

 

 

Edited by newsuba
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I got burned off by a stripped out DC2 Integra in my 2015 WRX, pretty embarrassing night.


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factory trim with fat bitches in the back and it still woulda smoked you.

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