Closed Deck Block Differences??

[nismovzr2003]

Hey guys,

Just a very quick question, is there any difference between a 89 RS Legacy or GT BF5 block? Also I see in one of the previous threads that people prefer using a rear thrust crank instead of the factory centre thrust as its better suited for heavier aftermarket clutch assemblies, if this is the case where can you find a rear thrust crank?

Thanks heaps

macca

[ADIKT]

funky has a rear thrust crank for sale soon. ej207 will probably require a polish

http://www.clubsub.org.nz/forum/index.php/topic,31456.0.html

[Pappu1]

there is no difference in the bare block of the 2 mentioned cars above

[funkytown]

yer they are considered better for the reasons you've mentioned.

Also they are linked with better BEB sustainability although not everyone agrees.

You can get any crank to fit in any block with machining of the 3rd or 5th thrust position.

[nismovzr2003]

 funkytown said:

yer they are considered better for the reasons you've mentioned.

Also they are linked with better BEB sustainability although not everyone agrees.

You can get any crank to fit in any block with machining of the 3rd or 5th thrust position.

Cheers funky, is it relatively easy to get the 3rd or 5th position machined? Anyone got a rough idea of how much it would cost to get this machined? Apart from machining the thrust position and re-honing the cylinders for new pistons, is there any other prep required for assembling with forged pistons & rods?

Cheers everyone for your replies!!

macca

[funkytown]

Im having this done to my closed deck right now. cost is a coupla hundie at max. Im also have it line bored but thats only required becuase im going with ARP case bolts. dont worry about that though.

Its hard to split the cost out but the two things being done is in the $500 range including having the block dipped and cleaned. The line boring is the more expensive bit.

Honing is a must then you can set up the pistons, and you should get the case faces decked and appropriate headgaskets chosen. Get a builder to file your rings to the appropriate clearances also, bearings need plastigauging. Thats all bread and butter stuff for an engine builder though.

[nismovzr2003]

 funkytown said:

Im having this done to my closed deck right now. cost is a coupla hundie at max. Im also have it line bored but thats only required becuase im going with ARP case bolts. dont worry about that though.

Its hard to split the cost out but the two things being done is in the $500 range including having the block dipped and cleaned. The line boring is the more expensive bit.

Honing is a must then you can set up the pistons, and you should get the case faces decked and appropriate headgaskets chosen. Get a builder to file your rings to the appropriate clearances also, bearings need plastigauging. Thats all bread and butter stuff for an engine builder though.

Thanks funky,

I was looking at going to ARP case bolts, is it a must or will the factory bolts be fine? I was under the impression factory bolts had to be replaced once the block was broken??

[funkytown]

no you can use new (not reuse the old ones) factory bolts if you wish.

The decision to put in ARP case bolts, head studs and the like are a case by case basis dependent on how deep your pockets are, how long you want the build to last and how much power you aim to make.

These are things to discuss with your engine builder.

One thing to note is that if you are using ARP case bolts they torque up much tighter than factory ones, and you can run the risk of locking the crank solid in your motor when building it. This is why you get it line bored - this then requires some altering of bits that sit on the cases across the cases as line boring removes a small amount from each face - so they sit slightly closer together. Again - is the current pain im experienceing but required for the horsepower i want to support.

(tuned to 500+hp, block capable of 600hp)

[nismovzr2003]

 funkytown said:

no you can use new (not reuse the old ones) factory bolts if you wish.

The decision to put in ARP case bolts, head studs and the like are a case by case basis dependent on how deep your pockets are, how long you want the build to last and how much power you aim to make.

These are things to discuss with your engine builder.

One thing to note is that if you are using ARP case bolts they torque up much tighter than factory ones, and you can run the risk of locking the crank solid in your motor when building it. This is why you get it line bored - this then requires some altering of bits that sit on the cases across the cases as line boring removes a small amount from each face - so they sit slightly closer together. Again - is the current pain im experienceing but required for the horsepower i want to support.

(tuned to 500+hp, block capable of 600hp)

I'm currently still running my factory open deck block on my v3, putting out 430Hp atw. Still running factory case bolts from memory and ARP head studs. As I want more power I thought it would be a good time to do a closed deck option with rear thrust crank, use all my existing wiseco pistons, eagle rods, heads, etc, etc an hopefully this will make a nice strong motor

[funkytown]

430whp is ALOT.. assuming approximate correction methods its in the range of 325wkw...

(a rougn 1.25x gives 540hp ~ 320+ wkw)

what set up (bolt ons) do you current run to get to that range? And if you want to run more power - how much more?

closed deck in that power range is a must really. as is the case bolts, arp head studs, larger oil pump and a host of other goodies to hold the power in.

[nismovzr2003]

 funkytown said:

430whp is ALOT.. assuming approximate correction methods its in the range of 325wkw...

(a rougn 1.25x gives 540hp ~ 320+ wkw)

what set up (bolt ons) do you current run to get to that range? And if you want to run more power - how much more?

closed deck in that power range is a must really. as is the case bolts, arp head studs, larger oil pump and a host of other goodies to hold the power in.

Let me think...lol

Garrett GT3082R with antisurge drilling

Sard 800cc Injectors

Front Mount

Sard Pressure Reg

Tial 44mm V-band wastegate

wiseco pistons

eagle rods

Link G3 with upgraded G4 firmware

3" exhaust

5 Bar MAP sensor

etc

etc

etc

I'm running into issues now with the engine breathing lol time for upgraded cams and adjustable cam gears, and the turbo's kinda at its limit with regards to boost, so hopefully when i do the cams & gears I should be able to lower the boost but sustain my current power level on the open deck block.

Going closed deck I'd like to achieve 500Hp atw if possible

[CUDDAS]

sorry slightly off topic 'nismovzr2003' are you running 4wd or rwd

I also have a Round power steering pump/tank in the shed $60.00 delivered will post in wanted topic too

[nismovzr2003]

 CUDDAS said:

sorry slightly off topic 'nismovzr2003' are you running 4wd or rwd

I also have a Round power steering pump/tank in the shed $60.00 delivered will post in wanted topic too

Hey CUDDAS,

Still running 4wd

cheers