Front end shuddering

[Guest]

 wildturkey']

[quote name='boostcut said:

in and out? as in hands at 12 and 6 oclock?

/quote]

nope not quite............when i had the hub off i grabbed the bit where the studz are and could get movement along the same line as the axle (in and out?)........and also grabbing the hub with one hand I had quite a bit of movement at the 12 and 6 oclock.............and also 9 and 3 oclock positions

That's play between the brg and the hub/knucle

The usual play that cause's issues in subaru front hubs is found by undoing CV nut

The play is created due to wear between the drive flange and the inner race of the wheel bearing (will look very rusty here too)

Often the wear/play is evident due to a low speed creaking noise

Remedy is to replace brg and drive flange with new, or 2nd hand complete hub

[Guest boostcut]

was the hub off the car? it sounds like we are going around in circles : there was no fn preload on the bearing and it was floping around...

[wildturkey]

 boostcut said:

there should theoretically be no play at all. if you have play something is worn

ahh ok then mine was pretty gone then............understandable I guess after being on there 20 years. But the thing is...........that movement was undetectable with the wheel jacked up and still on the car and trying to do the 12 and 6 oclock test. It was absolutely rock solid. It was only after taking the hub right off that the extent of the play could be seen and felt

[Guest boostcut]

a brand new bearing will have the play in it without the hub and cv preloading it.... this is frustating as shit aye....

[Guest]

 boostcut said:

was the hub off the car? it sounds like we are going around in circles : there was no fn preload on the bearing and it was floping around...

A wheel brg that has NO wear on the inner race will still have no play when cv nut undone

(unless drive flange has been started to be pushed out by disassembly)

[Guest]

 boostcut said:

a brand new bearing will have the play in it without the hub and cv preloading it.... this is frustating as **** aye....

Once it has been preloaded, then undone again it will only "relax" slightly but will still have no play !!

[Guest boostcut]

so your saying that you assemble it all on the car then tightennut up and loosen it and you have no play? i dont know what cars you have tryed that on but all the bearings ive done will have play. its how the bearing it constructed that requires it to be tight as fuk. if the only way to check a wheel brg was to undo the cv nut then damn wof inspectors would do it

[wildturkey]

ok sweet as.............so bottom line is..........with the hub right off, I could grab the bit where the studz are with one hand....wiggle it at any clock position you like and there was considerable play......i tried doing the same thing with the hub I was replacing it with and it had absolutely no play in it at all........ solid as. So my old one was rooted anyway

[Guest boostcut]

the inner race is two piece and the "hub" had probably been knocked or something as you can just tap it out with a hammer.

[Guest]

read my post properly, .......

your ref to wheel brg and wof .... noise and play is what is checked...

The reason you have play is when you put your brgs together is incorrect

The brgs/hubs are BEST assembled in a press NOT on the car

I can take ANY front drivehub replace the bearing and have NO play as i fit the hub to the car

All the CV nut is apply the predetermined preload (set by the brg)

Yes the nut does need to be tight, this is due to the loadings that go throught the front hub

[Guest]

 boostcut said:

the inner race is two piece and the "hub" had probably been knocked or something as you can just tap it out with a hammer.

Yes inner race two piece,

BUT NOTE they are an interference fit to the drive flange (YES) hence needing to be pressed to assemble

If the interfenence fit is wrong ( ie worn drive flange ) then the rear race will move and play will be evident

[Guest boostcut]

i have never tryed fitting a bearing with the hub still on the car... id say thatd be tricky... when i assemble a bearing i sit the hub flange on a socket and use another socket to press into the inner race in the back of the bearing. then check for play that way before fitting to car.. i have never had a problem doing it this way and will never change from doing it this way

[wildturkey]

 Ichi Ban']

[quote name='CUDDAS said:

hope it wasn't the disc rotor movement as the wheel hold's it to the hub, check that your cv 32mm nut is tight reel tight, & for the caliper check the dust boot's around the piston for splits, get some rubber grease & grease slider pins, push pistons in & pump them back out to free them up, if you need excess force to push them in they will need a re-co, get some 1200 grit sandpaper & clean up the piston, check piston for pitting, replace seal's ect, easy as that. cheers

/quote]

OK time for me to have a HUGE DUMMY SPIT

What the F are doing with sandpaper anywhere near a brake caliper piston !! MUPPET

Replacing seals is only easy for someone who know what they are doing !! MUPPET

Rubber grease on slider pins!! MUPPET

To be completely honest MOST of the forum users have NO idea how to OVERHAUL any hydraulic part of a braking system ! FACT

Take the caliper to someone who can fix it and fix it properly

This is your braking system for your 1200Kg missle.......

Please note, If you do repairs and as a direct result of those repairs cause and accident...... YOUR IN THE POOH !!

who would u recommend (in welly) to recon the caliper? Cheaper to replace or recon? cheers

Any good workshop or brake specialist

Where abouts are you in Wellywood

I'm in the hutt

[Guest]

 CUDDAS said:

POINT TAKEN, take it to a brake specialist, as there are a far too many death's on our roads, As for the 1200 grit "I should have read what i typed" you use this on alloy caliper's as you can't hone them, really you pollish the piston clean & have it checked for pitting/scoring. & we've found Rubber grease "sprey" doesn't gum up like coppercote over time. So sorry for the confusion

sweet, I just dont like guys /gals here playing with brakes etc when they have no idea what they are looing at (no offence should be taken by my comments)

Just seems that cars are common place that everyone want to have a go at fixing them...

Look at it this way, would you attempt to fix the brakes on a JUMBO jet? then test them out as a seated passenger knowing you played with the brakes

Some things in life are best left to those that know !!!

[Guest]

 wildturkey said:

I'm in the hutt

Contour brakes in Waterloo are very good

Or see Tom at Armstrongs in the Hutt (mention I sent you in and he'll sort you a deal)

[wildturkey]

cheers thanks for that

[Guest]

 boostcut said:

i have never tryed fitting a bearing with the hub still on the car... id say thatd be tricky... when i assemble a bearing i sit the hub flange on a socket and use another socket to press into the inner race in the back of the bearing. then check for play that way before fitting to car.. i have never had a problem doing it this way and will never change from doing it this way

Boosty,

So you are pressing them together then !! GOOD

You mentioned in an earlier post about know how the brg works

I ask you where is the play comming from after you have pressed the inner races over the drive flange and removed it from the press

(the only way you can have play is if an inner race moves !!! -- Think about it)

[Guest boostcut]

 Ichi Ban']

[quote name='boostcut said:

i have never tryed fitting a bearing with the hub still on the car... id say thatd be tricky... when i assemble a bearing i sit the hub flange on a socket and use another socket to press into the inner race in the back of the bearing. then check for play that way before fitting to car.. i have never had a problem doing it this way and will never change from doing it this way

/quote]

Boosty,

So you are pressing them together then !! GOOD

You mentioned in an earlier post about know how the brg works

I ask you where is the play comming from after you have pressed the inner races over the drive flange and removed it from the press

(the only way you can have play is if an inner race moves !!! -- Think about it)

i thort we were talking about a second hand bearing, he was saying that he has play in a second hand hub then there is no preload on it. of course there will be if the thing has been chucked around a wreckers yard, as they do.

but a new bearing pressed together properly wont have play but when you get them out of the packet there is movement. its hard to explain but i think there has been a little confusion in this post on my behalf, sorry about that Rick,

[Guest]

sweet

[wildturkey]

ok I'm happy to say my front end shuddering is a thing of the past. The caliper pistons were stuffed so ended up replacing the whole caliper. Bled it tonite and all good. So thanks for all the advice

[Guest]

 wildturkey said:

ok I'm happy to say my front end shuddering is a thing of the past. The caliper pistons were stuffed so ended up replacing the whole caliper. Bled it tonite and all good. So thanks for all the advice

Hows the shuddering after a few weeks? all good?

[wildturkey]

 gen11990']

[quote name='wildturkey said:

ok I'm happy to say my front end shuddering is a thing of the past. The caliper pistons were stuffed so ended up replacing the whole caliper. Bled it tonite and all good. So thanks for all the advice

/quote]

Hows the shuddering after a few weeks? all good?

yep problem not there anymore.........feels much better

[Guest]

 wildturkey said:

ok a bit of an update......first of all.......I learnt something I thought I'd share just in case ur thinking u might have a wheel bearing prob. After jacking the car up and doing the old 12 o'clock and 6 o'clock test for a mashed wheel bearing......(and then the 3 o'clock and 9 o'clock) I couldn't notice any movement at all...none.

What I was told by a wrecker mate though .....is that if your wheel nut is still done up tight the test won't work (except where the wheel bearing is EXTREMELY farkd). So i took the wheel off and loosened the wheel nut and that's when I could feel movement in the bearing......quite a bit of movement. So wheel bearings being quite $$$.........i just replaced the whole hub with one that had a good bearing in it.......and slapped in a new bottom arm ball joint while I was at it........here's the kicker though.........I still have the vibration problem!! lol

so after a short run we noticed that the passenger side brake disc was extremely hot compared to the other one so we're thinking one of the pots in the caliper (or both of them) isn't retracting.......so my next mish is to replace the caliper........or recondition it

I checked the engine mounts they are all good

I also checked the lower arm bushes they are all good

an update on this would be mean!!! as iv got the same problem as this and have done and spent $$$ on the same things as you, i get it at anything over 80-100 for get about 160-180 the car shakes so hard its a massage machine on freaking steroids and P at them speeds, im use to it now lol as i kinda gave up... been looking for soooo long for a fix but should just take it in but then i lose the game damit...

[Guest]

sorry didt read all the post's :

[Guest]

i mentioned a while back about mine shaking, i can confirm it was the wheel bearing, but more so the spline that the bearing slots/sits onto was worn out on the the hub as no matter how much it was tightened it still had play. No bearing noise though. Replaced the whole hub and the shaking dissapeared, hope that helps GF8M8