Bolt in cage?? Cert?

[Guest]

Hi all,

Just a quick question.. Does a bolt in cage need to be certed at all? Its a full cage btw not half

Cheers

[WRXER]

Bolt in cages are useless mate, and also very dangerous as other members will attest.. Unless MSNZ certified u will not be able to enter it into any sanctioned racing events, Im currently getting a full cage put in and there is alot of work to go with it. And this is even before certification which I still gotta go through. http://www.clubsub.org.nz/forum/index.php/topic,4268.0.html

Oh and if just for road use, then biff it mate. It's highly illegal and I'll highly doubt it will pass cert without documentation ie Logbook etc..

The thread below is all the details u need in order to get a cage put in.

http://www.clubsub.org.nz/forum/index.php/topic,2983.0.html

[pl0x]

im not arguing the fact that there good, but want to know why there not?

surely there better than not? i mean if i was to roll id rather have a bolt-in than not??

[dubbedup]

i think its do do with the fact that there are additional bars in your car that you/your passengers could hit their heads on....and because it is only bolted in it has more likelihood of ripping out and causing more damage than if is wasn't there to begin with,

[Koom]

 pl0x said:

im not arguing the fact that there good, but want to know why there not?

surely there better than not? i mean if i was to roll id rather have a bolt-in than not??

They're not triangulated properly so rather than providing protection during a rollover, they are going to collapse on you, making it harder to cut the roof off to get you out after they have crushed your head against the headrest and your legs under the dash........

They are really just an ornament to go with 5" tacho's on the dash.

You can get bolt in cages that are certable, but none of the japanese ones are, they have bends in the wrong places and they don't meet the MNZ standards.

[WRXER]

Also car's are designed with crumple zones etc to protect the unprotected body. Ur safer in a normal car for street driving. To be honest u wouldnt want to be in a roll over in a cage without a helmet as trust me one hit on the head on the bars, and you'll be 6 feet under in no time. It freaking hurt just banging mine on a bar today lol

They are designed to be used in conjunction with full safety gear as even with the padding and a helmet on it still going to hurt big time....Just imagine ur skull smashing into a bar without anything.

[Guest]

Woah big response haha but yes I also thought be better to have it there than nothing at all but after you guys mention those points may have changed my mind... ???

Just didn't want to go down the full weld in cage route just yet because I can't see myself entering at least 2 MSNZ events a year, yet still want a street legal car. Just have to wait and see what happens then..

[WRXER]

Fair enough mate, there are still quite a few clubsport days and alike u don't need cages...Good chance to trial a few, see how you go and if u are keen to go down the more serious road.

It's only after 4 years of owning my current wrx have I decided to go down the cage road.

[dubbedup]

The only thing that is holding me back from caging my rex is the fact of needing a rear seat....

[scooby-wrx]

Read the bottom left of page 120 and see the pictures on page 153 of the link below.

http://www.performancecar.co.nz/events/super-lap/entry-form/MSNZ_SCHEDULE.A.pdf

I have a 6 point Safety 21 / Cusco cage in my car at the moment (uncerted). I like it because I can keep my rear seats in. From the link above it looks like I need a cross bar in the rear to have it certed. This would require me to remove my rear seats and register the vehicle as a 2 seater...!

I only have the cage because I got a good deal and I was under the impression that it would be safer having one, than not having one... As long as the padding is sufficient and it is secured properly.

Cusco:

http://images.google.co.nz/imgres?imgurl=http://www.cusco.co.jp/en/img/rb_cusco.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.cusco.co.jp/en/parts_product/products/roll_cage.html&usg=__fm6eT40TFqMOxX4xMw54ieRF-d8=&h=134&w=200&sz=7&hl=en&start=126&um=1&tbnid=MnFK1PS5y-lG9M:&tbnh=70&tbnw=104&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dsafety%2B21%2Broll%2Bcage%26ndsp%3D20%26hl%3Den%26rlz%3D1T4GGLG_enNZ316NZ316%26sa%3DN%26start%3D120%26um%3D1

Some pics of mine:

[Koom]

I would refuse to get in that car if it was going round a track.

I'd rather go without a cage than with something like that in it. Those rear bars are ugly and are only ever going to collapse if you tip the car over. Also that padding is nowhere near thick enough to make any difference if your head was to smash into it, it looks like hot water pipe lagging.

I could go on picking faults with the design of these cages but I'm gonna stop there for now. You seriously would be safer without it!

[scooby-wrx]

Fair enough, but I would never take it around a track as it is "uncerted"... Oh and I'd still rather have it in that not, as Cusco would have tested it during developing it and would not release an un-safe item to the public.

 Koom said:

I would refuse to get in that car if it was going round a track.

I'd rather go without a cage than with something like that in it. Those rear bars are ugly and are only ever going to collapse if you tip the car over. Also that padding is nowhere near thick enough to make any difference if your head was to smash into it, it looks like hot water pipe lagging.

I could go on picking faults with the design of these cages but I'm gonna stop there for now. You seriously would be safer without it!

[scooby-wrx]

True...

May have a 6 point bolt in cage for sale if anyone is interested...?

 loren']

All cages operated without a full race harness, helmet, and approved padding are MORE dangerous than no cage.

FACT.

Fair enough, but I would never take it around a track as it is "uncerted"... Oh and I'd still rather have it in that not, as Cusco would have tested it during developing it and would not release an un-safe item to the public.

[quote name='Koom said:

I would refuse to get in that car if it was going round a track.

I'd rather go without a cage than with something like that in it. Those rear bars are ugly and are only ever going to collapse if you tip the car over. Also that padding is nowhere near thick enough to make any difference if your head was to smash into it, it looks like hot water pipe lagging.

I could go on picking faults with the design of these cages but I'm gonna stop there for now. You seriously would be safer without it!

/quote]

[pl0x]

lmfao i think this is not the place to sell it now...

[newsuba]

 Koom said:

I would refuse to get in that car if it was going round a track.

I'd rather go without a cage than with something like that in it. Those rear bars are ugly and are only ever going to collapse if you tip the car over. Also that padding is nowhere near thick enough to make any difference if your head was to smash into it, it looks like hot water pipe lagging.

I could go on picking faults with the design of these cages but I'm gonna stop there for now. You seriously would be safer without it!

Good call.

Frankly 99% of these after-market bolt-in cages are nothing but expensive crap.

Cusco et al probably do test them but under less stringent rules than say Porsche, Lotus or Renaultsport, whose optional cages meet tough German TUV and FIA rules.

[Joker]

bolt in rear hoop however.....

(defined as one that does not enter the forward passenger compartment)

is 1/10th betterer than a bolt in 'cage'

[WRXER]

Spot the difference

Rear of Bolt In Cage

Rear of full welded in 8 point cage in my wrx.

And I'm by no means an engineer but it is very easy to see how that type of cage would collapse in you on a roll over. Ultimately crushing any poor rear passengers as there is no cross beams to counter any forces put onto those bars.

[Guest]

 WRXER said:

Rear of full welded in 8 point cage in my wrx.

weres the roof ???

-smurff

[nt_a_foz]

custom convertable wrx..aint you seen them man?? lol

[QRAF]

its so its lighter and more aero dynamic

[newsuba]

 JoKer said:

bolt in rear hoop however.....

(defined as one that does not enter the forward passenger compartment)

is 1/10th betterer than a bolt in 'cage'

Pedantically true.

;D

[evlRA]

I have a 4 point cusco bolt in half cage

It is low volume certified and passes wofs etc. It also allows me to run 10seccond passes at meremere

Only reasons i have the bolt in half cage:

1). Light

2). Easy to remove and put back in etc. (10-20mins)

3). Allows me to run 10seccond passes without being banned from the track

[scooby-wrx]

Nice! Any chance of some pictures...?

 evlRA said:

I have a 4 point cusco bolt in half cage

It is low volume certified and passes wofs etc. It also allows me to run 10seccond passes at meremere

Only reasons i have the bolt in half cage:

1). Light

2). Easy to remove and put back in etc. (10-20mins)

3). Allows me to run 10seccond passes without being banned from the track

[evlRA]

http://www.clubsub.org.nz/forum/index.php/topic,1662.15.html

[Tony]

 evlRA said:

3). Allows me to run 10seccond passes without being banned from the track

Does NZDRA allow bolt in jap cages for running 10s???

I thought they were quite strict about tubing thickness etc for cars running that quick - and also dont they require tech inspection to be compliable??? I wouldnt think that one of those cages would pass.

I could be wrong though (I dont know much about drag racing), but I have a few friends whose cars run 10s and quicker and their cages are fairly beefy - most notably the main hoop - the tubing is a bigger diameter than my MSNZ spec cage.