Straight Bolt On Turbos

[Stoffa]

Heres what I got...started life as a vf36, now its got a ported P20 housing so i can sick with a factory manifold. Its had some MSE magic stuff and things done including what I'm pretty sure is the biggest compressor wheel you'd be able to fit in a factory front cover (50.5 inducer and 68 exducer, pretty much an 18G), notice how much thinner than factory the walls are where the intake clamps on.

The builds not finished yet so cant comment on performance but after driving a mates V7 sti with a similar turbo (but smaller compressor wheel) running just shy of 240kw on Speedtechs dyno, I was VERY impressed.

anyway heres the pics, the actuator came off a PE1820 not from MSE

[Guest]

fuck thats a nice turbo man.

who did all the magial bits to it.you guna run internal gate wth it?

[Stoffa]

Steve Murch, yep running internal gate, but that actuator has a 14psi spring in it, so better control

[Pappu1]

did you change the spring on the internal?

dam i been meaning to get a higher spring on my internal for a while but unsure on whats the process..

anyone.....?

[Guest]

 Stoffa said:

Steve Murch, yep running internal gate, but that actuator has a 14psi spring in it, so better control

nice man!did steve murch supply the wastegate to?im looking for a upgraded actuater

[WRXONP]

External for the win change spring easily

[sultan]

externals are gay. spending the extra $500 on a better turbo is a much better idea

[WRXER]

 sultan said:

externals are gay. spending the extra $500 on a better turbo is a much better idea

+ 1

[WRXONP]

Ever seen a top level car with an internal ? All high power drag cars have external . . It doesnt take a rocket scientist to figure out what controlls boost better

[sultan]

that's like saying a cessna should be jet powered because f18 hornets are jet powered. i can't recall seeing any top level drag cars driving to the dairy to get milk either come to think of it.

[PhatRS]

and the turbos they use dont have internals.

[WRXONP]

Lol wonder why they didn't come with internal ? ? ?

[sultan]

because when dealing with 700hp+ quite a large amount of exhaust gas is generated therefore a lot is required to be diverted to control boost.

do you have a 700hp car? no.

[Koom]

Stupid arguments are stupid. So I will add that Prodrive don't need externals to make ~700Nm @4k rpm out of a 2.0L engine by shoving 4 Bar down its throat. Although in their case you'd barely need a wastegate at all :

And I'd argue that a WRC car would be more useful for popping down to the dairy for some milk than a drag car built to the same level.

^ $14k brand new.

[sultan]

 WRXONP said:

Lol wonder why they didn't come with internal ? ? ?

i find it ironic you see the value in an external wastegate, but not in injectors, ecu and tuning.

[vorigan]

Great pics Koom i have a few of those turbos and their bigger brother.

Internals are done for ease of manufacturing people like audi porche bently for years have used externals, as power levels increase the better need for better control thus externals become a must but mounting them becomes an issue as in a stock sub not having alot of room to work with.

The main issue with internals is the increased backpresure on the turbine due to the gate outlet being of higher velocity than the exhaust thus why drop pipes run a seperate tube/divider which enters further down the front pipe to help reduce the problem.

The fact that most subs suffer from boost drop off on the topend increasing the gate size or to larger external if running one makes this more of an issue, in this case a stronger actuator on the internal is a far better option.

[WRXONP]

Wow very pointless arguement . .. Do you think im finished with my car ? Mate its barely started . . . An external can hold shut for longer and hold shut harder than an internal can . . It will make more power . . Whilst internal leaks open . . . External is shut spooling the turbo then it opens at full boost

[rex-leggy]

still both systems reach the same goal ....... so arguing why?

[sultan]

because an external wastegate on most street cars is about as useful as underbody neon lights

[Pappu1]

How to get a stronger actuator on the internal??

Externals do win in that respect anyway as changing springs on it sounds better that whatever how to get a stronger actuator on Internal - which I still dunno how. Lol

[Stoffa]

 pappu said:

How to get a stronger actuator on the internal??

heres one way

http://www.forgemotorsport.co.uk/content.asp?inc=product&cat=0001&product=FMAC3SUB

you can order them with 3 different springs to choose from, or you can custom fit one with a stronger spring from a different turbo

[sultan]

the cost of an external plus fitting it is twice that of a good boost controller, which you need any way.

[WRXONP]

Not really . You can get an external waste gate for cheap . If you are a welder or know a welder then fitting is cheap or free . . . . In my case free. . . And why not go the whole hog and put a electronic controller on an external waste gate . . This is pointless conversation as the external will create more power . I had a rb30 with hybrid turbonetics turbo . On same tune it made 180kw (run in on 10). . . Changed nothing but fitted external with 10 pound spring got it re dynod at 191 kw and was wheel spinning the bags from too low with too much camber . . And dyno sheet proved that external was holding shut harder thus making more power right through the rev range . .. Set the suspension higher and got link re tuned and made 250kw on 1 bar with 11 afr . . So the moral of the story is a external waste gate will hold shut thus creating more power instead of it leaking out the weak internal . . Plus you will get much better boost control with a external waste gate staying open rather than a small internal shuttling open and closed . . Fact . . Ask people who tune the cars . . . Im out now so you can reply and say you little internal is better but I dont really care . . Theres so much proof out there that external is better than internal

[Guest]

shit thats a mean turbo/motor setup,must be worth a fortune

[sultan]

by the time you're making peak power, your wastegate should be open. a wastegate is a device to LIMIT your power or boost, not make MORE of it. if you made more peak power on the dyno, your cheap external was NOT doing it's job properly.