Gen2 vs Gen3

[GravelBen]

 ReubenH said:

And the being lighter thing is a bonus. Only 1460 KG's for a BG GTB (factory given figure).

In both cases, ONLY buy manual GTB's/RSB's

Compared to 1480-1510kg (later cars heavier) for a BH GTB - the difference is like carrying a small child around with you, or maybe filling the fuel tank. Not much really!

Agreed about manuals though, no question there.

My experience would also agree with the poster commenting on BH's having less understeer than BG, though if you really want an understeer-resistant Sub you should buy an STi-RA Impreza

[ReubenH]

My BG had understeer on it's lift springs and Nankang NS2's. I went and put factory springs in, Adrenalins, and a wheel alignment... And the understeer was gone. I've not had any understeer since, and all it was, was good tyres and a wheel alignment. I think it's a null point, both cars do perform really well.

BUT, here's the kicker, the BH will most likely actually corner better, I will admit this. There's a few under car goodies they get that the BG's don't. But they still feel numb to drive, i'd not give up my BG for a BH any day. Plus, with the minimal work i've done to mine now, it handles better than a stock BH anyway, and i've still yet to even touch things like V7 STi struts.

One amusing thing i did find though, and this actually goes against what glen said about BH's understeering less. My GTB has 19mm front and rear sway bars. I found that spotme's BH GTB only had a 15mm rear sway bar... I found that curious... Maybe something to do with them being multilink rear suspension?

As for converting, it's much easier to convert a manual BG GTB than it is a BH. V3/4 stuff is MUCH more available than V5/6 stuff, and there's none of that fuel pump controller bullcrap. But it's only manual GTB and RSB's that count. any pre 96, or any auto will be a cunt of a job. Been there, done that, and we're still stuck trying to figure out wiring.

[GravelBen]

 ReubenH said:

... And the understeer was gone. I've not had any understeer since, and all it was, was good tyres and a wheel alignment. I think it's a null point, both cars do perform really well.

Yep, the limits of both are high enough that with half-decent tyres you shouldn't really be encountering understeer on public roads unless you've done something wrong! My BH is pretty loose on gravel though I must say, no shortage of entertainment there...

It amazes me how many people do buy a fast car and put crap rubber on it, kinda defeats the point really. I'm having a lot of fun trying to wear out the kingstars on the back of the MX5 but that doesn't count as a fast car just a fun one.

[ReubenH]

Very true indeed. And people driving without good wheel alignments too, $60 and it can make the car handle so much better.

[MINTGTB]

BH/BE's FTW!!!

BG and BD's are henious.. ;D play nice Reuby.. hahaha! plus a Gen.3 set a new world speed record for mass-produced turbocharged station wagons with small engines (1600cc - 2000cc class), clocking at 270.532 km/h (168.101 mph) over one kilometer on Highway 10 in La Junta, Colorado.

Previous land speed record was held by a Gen.2 hahaha! losers!

[ReubenH]

The previous record was also an underpowered BG5A GT. The BG GTB could have got 270 i swear!

[GravelBen]

IIRC the BC5 RS held the fastest production car 10,000km enduro record for a while too!

[MINTGTB]

 ReubenH said:

The previous record was also an underpowered BG5A GT. The BG GTB could have got 270 i swear!

Insert Tui slogan..

[Guest]

Bahaha

I have to admit i took my folks' BH GTB to Mt Hutt one day for lols and i was impressed with it.

Handled the bumpy, sh1tty access road with aplomb and once we got down to flat blew away all the poser ski tossers in their VWs and Prados back to chch!

[Munkvy]

Reuben - stop being so one eyed. BG5s understeer massively. The Bilsteins are ok, but if you try to push any reasonable amount of speed on road tyres or semi slicks the car rolls sufficiently that it weight transfers to the outside wheel and scrubs off speed as it sledges off the chosen line. They are NOT a performance car, just an enthusiastic family station wagon.

Chuck some coilovers in them and they do sit alot flatter - but you can still feel the nose wanting to run wide once you push them. Theres too much weight over the front end and theres nothing you can do about it, short of carbon fibre and a lighter engine.

I have a bit of experience with BG5s having tracked mine, dragged it and been very competitive at autocrosses even in it (I once won the 4WD class at a gravel autocross in mine). But thats more due to having no mechanical sympathy than the car having good handling.

I have no experience with BH/BEs sadly, but Im more than happy to go rape someones to compare if anyones brave enough and has a mechanical warranty covering rebuilds? Everything I have heard from BH/BE owners is that the VOD is greatly reduced? However that wont make F all difference once your out of 1st gear as you should never be off the 2nd turbo when thrashing the car. I have no idea if there is much handling difference in a BH/BE though?

However all my dislike of BG5 handling aside - I have managed on a number of occasions to hold my own against WRXs in a straight line once over 100km/hr at the drags, as well as keeping the odd Honda at bay on tighter roads. If you are really cruel to them you can make them turn. Just dont expect them to do it without a fight.

[BC5RA]

 GravelBen said:

IIRC the BC5 RS held the fastest production car 10,000km enduro record for a while too!

100,000km's @ an average speed of 223kph.

[Guest keltik]

Welcome to take mine for a good raping viv. If clunt hasnt broken his H6 after 80,000kms im sure mine will survive

Rear suspension setup is much better in the BH/BE in my opinion. Interior is streets ahead, VDC and VTD options became available, turbos are better, heads are better, gearbox is stronger, rear seats recline, rear center seat belt is a full 3 point, more sound deadening and insulation on the high spec models, alloy bonnets on the H6 and possibly TT models, better designed floor in the boot with cool trays and drawers and more comfortable seats in the front.

Thats just off the top of my head. But i know for a fact around a track a stock BH will make mince out of a stock BG

[pl0x]

my be doesn't have fold down seats like my old bd.

my bd understeered REALLY badly, like a fwd lol

[Munkvy]

 keltik said:

Welcome to take mine for a good raping viv. If clunt hasnt broken his H6 after 80,000kms im sure mine will survive

Rear suspension setup is much better in the BH/BE in my opinion. Interior is streets ahead, VDC and VTD options became available, turbos are better, heads are better, gearbox is stronger, rear seats recline, rear center seat belt is a full 3 point, more sound deadening and insulation on the high spec models, alloy bonnets on the H6 and possibly TT models, better designed floor in the boot with cool trays and drawers and more comfortable seats in the front.

Thats just off the top of my head. But i know for a fact around a track a stock BH will make mince out of a stock BG

I was meaning a B4 to compare to mine. But I would sure love to drive yours anyway Ive driven a mates H6 Lancaster (bog standard) and I reckon they go quite well. So yours with the manual etc would be great fun, although isnt your gearbox an old Legacy item? In which case perhaps I shouldnt drive it, gearboxes dont seem to agree with me.

[Guest keltik]

Hmmm you do have a point. Ill wait untill the spare box is in the shed ready then you can finish off my current leprosy ridden one

[Munkvy]

 keltik said:

Hmmm you do have a point. Ill wait untill the spare box is in the shed ready then you can finish off my current leprosy ridden one

I take it you dont regularly limiter launch then? Your missing out...

[Guest]

My BE feels fucking fantastic with the coil overs i just put in, got front strut brace too, keen for an aftermarket rear sway bar.

i love my car, its an awesome cruiser, and gets up and goes when you want it too. I haven't driven a gen 2, so yeah, can't really say which one i liked better, looks play a big part in my books, so straight away the be/bh is up on the bg

[pl0x]

omegah, your sig says 223kw? you get it dyno'd at that? what mods?

[funkytown]

 Munkvy']

[quote name='keltik said:

Hmmm you do have a point. Ill wait untill the spare box is in the shed ready then you can finish off my current leprosy ridden one

/quote]

I take it you dont regularly limiter launch then? Your missing out...

its got a really short box... well for the reving of the H6 anyway. I owned a BG and have driven BH's and they are soo soo much nicer.. in every dimension - exterior, interior, mechanical..

Bens in nice to drive but its whale'ish are having the legacy drive worn off after a year of wrx driving

[MINTGTB]

 pl0x said:

omegah, your sig says 223kw? you get it dyno'd at that? what mods?

i'll only believe dat power figure until i see the dyno sheet..

[Guest]

 MINTGTB']

[quote name='pl0x said:

omegah, your sig says 223kw? you get it dyno'd at that? what mods?

/quote]

i'll only believe dat power figure until i see the dyno sheet..

+10000

-smurff

[Treecrusher]

I've owned and sold both (although not a 95, but a 97 GTB).

The BH in definatly a much better car. Interior, speed, handling and VOD are much better.

But IMO you are better of ditching the legacy until you can afford a BP legacy and just buying a WRX which is much more drivable than any of the twin turbos. Thats what I'm doing.

[webup]

 Treecrusher said:

I've owned and sold both (although not a 95, but a 97 GTB).

The BH in definatly a much better car. Interior, speed, handling and VOD are much better.

But IMO you are better of ditching the legacy until you can afford a BP legacy and just buying a WRX which is much more drivable than any of the twin turbos. Thats what I'm doing.

What do you define driveable as???

I find a TT BH far more driveable around town than any WRX.

[ReubenH]

I don't. Twin turbo does now qualify as 'drivable'. When around town driving in my GTB, i hit vod several times a day, it was a true nuisance. And just telling someone to modify their driving to work with twin turbo is simply not good enough. The ZS controller helped immensely though.

[pl0x]

Only problem i have with TT is when i drop from 5th to 3rd etc to pass. does some stupid things sometimes

i.e spool primary then drop of straight away then spool 2ndary. or just lags for abit then 2ndary kicks in.

where a single turbo would just pull straight away

but yea i love the primary turbo around town.