Insurance Thread 2.0

pl0x · April 22, 2009

Shale said:

Like I said. I don't expect the $35k back I've spent if in ANOTHER emergency - but I DO want reasonable replacement value should my (frankly, HUSBAND) go missing or be destroyed. I don't want to go from driving a reasonable Subaru to being stuck with a rickety old HX - keep in mind mine was absolutely mint when I got it, and super duper downgrading is not part of my plans if sh!t hits the fan.

So stop pointing fingers

Wdf u have spent $35k on ur car? and its n/a?

April 22, 2009

Fastfour said:

Try Clic Car insurance

Think its 0800 CARLOVE

+1 on Clic they're pretty friendly and seem all good with mods and the like

In saying that I'm with NZI but I think you got to go through a broker.

Shale · April 22, 2009

pl0x - A combination of reasons. Too complicated to explain here but let's just say that one thing led to another, and there's a crazy engine plan in the works over the next few years. :-\

pl0x · April 22, 2009

i was gona say, sounds like you have on the cards brembo's and a 6 speed which i was thinking NA?????? why?

but i c

Shale · April 22, 2009

Yeh there's the 6MT/brembo conversion waiting, but also a new engine or two. Long-arse story, all shall be revealed within the forseeable future I'm actually BUYING stuff for once. Lol.

Also big thanks to Jase et al - Clic have given me a quote that varies between $400 and $700 less than NAC, and at first glance the policy seems more reasonable. They also won't crucify me for modifying the f**king thing. So far so good...

After that I will do the work and get it professionally valued

CMPLSV · April 22, 2009

If you were ringing for quotes you should have rung saying that the mods had already been done - that way they probly would have just asked for an insured value instead lol..... thats what i did once i started modding my old civic....

April 22, 2009

Shale said:

Turtle - Don't worry I think you're right

I'm just f**ked off at their bad attitude right now, basically it's implied that it doesn't matter what I put into it...I'll still basically get $7k in the hand if I'm lucky. Maybe the cow was PMSing or something. Lmao.

Sounds like it may be worth throwing more security at the car, because insurance isn't going to be helpful if it walks again.

Joker - the car is insured currently for $13k, and when the gearbox and breaks go in...that's over $25k of EXTRAS alone that have gone into it. I wouldn't expect even $20k for it total, even in that state... but if a thief were to sell my box and brakes alone, they would get back more from that than I would from insurance for the WHOLE car.

You are a fucking dreamer.

You are 22, imprezas are known to be stolen frequently, the car in question has been stolen and almost written off before. You are wanting to add mods to the vehicle,worth more than the vehicle which will not alter the value of the vehicle by much. It is no surprise NAC want rid of you as they are realists.

Essentially it doesnt matter what you put onto the vehicle. A car is worth what someone will pay for it. Dress it up as much as you like(wank wank engine transplant, wank wank 6mt and brembos) but no one in their right mind would pay more cash for a vehicle which would still be outbraked, out accelerated and out handled by most STis out there.

Im sorry im being harsh. Its all fine and dandy to have a retarded plan like this, its your life. However, in the real world it doesnt matter what bits you throw at a turd, it still is a turd, and will hence be valued as a turd.

Dont expect the insurance companies to bend over backwards to accomodate you.

DPI · April 22, 2009

Wow, that WAS a bit harsh

You have to admit, these insurance companies do try it on...

They are in a business where risk is an occupational hazzard, but rather than play the odds and make a tidy profit, they basically load up on no-brainers and refuse anything that has even the wiff of risk!

It's not just mods either; there are many vehicle owners out there who can't even get cover for their std vehicles, especially if their titles include STI, Evolution, GT-R or HSV.

We have a customer who owns a low k's NZ new Integra Type R; He was with Pioneer and his policy lapsed, so he tried to renew but they won't insure him.

I rang around and no-one else will either...at any price.

He has coilovers, an exhaust and a brand new Mugen engine as mods, he also has a full (clean) licence, two alarms (factory AND aftermarket), a secure garage and is 27 Y/O.

He also has a $600,000 house and was happy to have his home and contents insured along with the car...

And still a BIG FAT NO!

Way i see it, these companies are either in the business of insuring shit or they ain't.

Shale · April 22, 2009

DPI said:

Wow, that WAS a bit harsh

You have to admit, these insurance companies do try it on...

They are in a business where risk is an occupational hazzard, but rather than play the odds and make a tidy profit, they basically load up on no-brainers and refuse anything that has even the wiff of risk!

It's not just mods either; there are many vehicle owners out there who can't even get cover for their std vehicles, especially if their titles include STI, Evolution, GT-R or HSV.

We have a customer who owns a low k's NZ new Integra Type R; He was with Pioneer and his policy lapsed, so he tried to renew but they won't insure him.

I rang around and no-one else will either...at any price.

He has coilovers, an exhaust and a brand new Mugen engine as mods, he also has a full (clean) licence, two alarms (factory AND aftermarket), a secure garage and is 27 Y/O.

He also has a $600,000 house and was happy to have his home and contents insured along with the car...

And still a BIG FAT NO!

Way i see it, these companies are either in the business of insuring shit or they ain't.

THANK YOU, VOICE OF REASON.

Seems to me the only dreamers here are the ones that want to tack on a list of why I fail in their opinion, and somehow relate that to an unrelated situation. As if the world only exists in their eyes, from their point of view. Let them eat cake; it'll be a rude shock to find one day that the world plays by its own rules, not the ones that THEY dictate. Sorry boys... your heads may be big but they're NOT their own force of gravity.

Ross darling, perhaps you should go back and re-read what you've just written. Because what you just said is that in your theory, a vehicle with Brembo brakes and aftermarket rotors recommended for upped braking force (thus chewing through the rotors faster), that is from factory lighter than 'most STis out there' (or ALL STis out there I should mention, without serious weight reduction), is going to be outbraked by, say, a 1350-ish kg vehicle with narrower disks of a smaller circumference that returns less braking force than aforemetioned Brembos - simply because of its VIN tag. Sorry I didn't realise physics work like that...that a vehicle can be posessed by an aura that prevents it, despite what may actually turn out to be proper facts and figures, to be outperformed by what it is specified to outperform.

You learn something new every day.

Tell me - is there any way to swap out this mystical aura of fail?

I mean, Retna projects seem to have done that. After all, they're just sh!tty old 1994 FWD auto 1500cc pieces of kak with 300hp+ Group N motors, dogboxes, widened body kits, not a scrap of sound deadening, seam welds, competition brakes, rally handling setups and rollcages...what could they do. They're still slower than Corollas and boatier than the Titanic deep down inside, but they seem fairly nippy when they're in competition for mere Retnas. Guess we're all imagining things.

Interestingly enough NAC of all places specifically insure such failures of vehicles for damage and theft - they don't cover for damage during competition, but they sure as hell cover for damage outside that scenario.

And there are mighty 10-second WRXs out there, even STis that have been built to do this (insurable, I might add)... on the outside they embarrass some mighty machines, machines designed specifically for drag. They're barely street legal and about as highly-strung as they get. Of course, deep down inside they're just STis, or WRXs, certainly not designed for drag! Useless damn vehicles, certainly not good for the 10 seconds they clock up on the strip.

I guess that thread in the Stolen forum is relevant...go have a peek.

And in the meantime, I'll have to go research this theory about a car still being a slow turd no matter what goes into it. There's a perfect example going on in the states that I might just have to link. It's an Impreza L...1800cc FWD auto POS that's getting a complete roll cage, every useless bit of metal trimmed off, seamwelds from one end to the other and a 400hp Subaru motor. I'll have a close darn look and see what they trim out...maybe they'll find the fail and trim it out, so it can be fast like its 400hp motor says it will.

I mean heck, in theory I might do something stupid and drop that $15,000 race motor in and see what happens. It's not like I don't have an 800hp-proof box waiting for such a thing. Bet it'll still be slow though, and worth nothing (despite having a specifically GC8 chassis, the same one as the WRX and STi). If I was really, really retarded I could give it the dry-ice-and-hammer treatment, scrape out as much sealant as I could, have it sandblasted and seam welded, then donk a mortgage's worth of Whiteline/Cusco/Prodrive goodness into it and see what happens...will probably still be kak though. Worth absolutely nothing if I was blasphemous enough to simply strip it and drop a complete STi driveline into it from one end to another, register it as actually having a turbo in it, and consider it a WRX of sorts with every single STi part the book specifies. Still worth nothing, slow as hell. Certainly slower than the donor car ever was, with all the same gear.

Boy, that whole aura thing must be miiiiighty powerful.

IN FACT... perhaps we could unlock more power from vehicles by finding the fail, chopping it out...then we won't have to worry about shopping lists and VTEC stickers any more.

There's a sneaky scheme if ever I saw one.

Stay tuned... I might just have to add a slab of relevant links from other forums for the sake of a good read.

Oh. By the way.

Do that sh!t again and I'm hitting the report button. Seriously - there is absolutely no reason, in a civilised Western country, to behave like that. No reason at all. Other people can make their points clear without being vulgar and abusive...why can't you?

driftrex · April 22, 2009

Shale said:

I've heard a few good things about State. How old are ya? I'm 22 so many just show me the door, lol.

im 24 but have have the car insured since i was 22, almost 25 so premiums should drop alot very soon :-)

Jammasta · April 22, 2009

BTW my premiums barely changed when i turned 25. the excesses dropped by alot tho.

April 22, 2009

TURTLE said:

BTW my premiums barely changed when i turned 25. the excesses dropped by alot tho.

strange, opposite here, excess drpped a little but prem went down almost half

Shale · April 22, 2009

Clic muttered something about them both dropping at 25, one more than the other; assuming it would be excess, considering the risk of epic fail is considered less when you're wiser

Frankly a drop in either would be welcome eh, lol.

Three more years... :-\

April 22, 2009

Shale']
[quote name='DPI said:

Wow, that WAS a bit harsh

You have to admit, these insurance companies do try it on...

They are in a business where risk is an occupational hazzard, but rather than play the odds and make a tidy profit, they basically load up on no-brainers and refuse anything that has even the wiff of risk!

It's not just mods either; there are many vehicle owners out there who can't even get cover for their std vehicles, especially if their titles include STI, Evolution, GT-R or HSV.

We have a customer who owns a low k's NZ new Integra Type R; He was with Pioneer and his policy lapsed, so he tried to renew but they won't insure him.

I rang around and no-one else will either...at any price.

He has coilovers, an exhaust and a brand new Mugen engine as mods, he also has a full (clean) licence, two alarms (factory AND aftermarket), a secure garage and is 27 Y/O.

He also has a $600,000 house and was happy to have his home and contents insured along with the car...

And still a BIG FAT NO!

Way i see it, these companies are either in the business of insuring shit or they ain't.

/quote]

THANK YOU, VOICE OF REASON.

Seems to me the only dreamers here are the ones that want to tack on a list of why I fail in their opinion, and somehow relate that to an unrelated situation. As if the world only exists in their eyes, from their point of view. Let them eat cake; it'll be a rude shock to find one day that the world plays by its own rules, not the ones that THEY dictate. Sorry boys... your heads may be big but they're NOT their own force of gravity.

Ross darling, perhaps you should go back and re-read what you've just written. Because what you just said is that in your theory, a vehicle with Brembo brakes and aftermarket rotors recommended for upped braking force (thus chewing through the rotors faster), that is from factory lighter than 'most STis out there' (or ALL STis out there I should mention, without serious weight reduction), is going to be outbraked by, say, a 1350-ish kg vehicle with narrower disks of a smaller circumference that returns less braking force than aforemetioned Brembos - simply because of its VIN tag. Sorry I didn't realise physics work like that...that a vehicle can be posessed by an aura that prevents it, despite what may actually turn out to be proper facts and figures, to be outperformed by what it is specified to outperform.

You learn something new every day.

Tell me - is there any way to swap out this mystical aura of fail?

I mean, Retna projects seem to have done that. After all, they're just sh!tty old 1994 FWD auto 1500cc pieces of kak with 300hp+ Group N motors, dogboxes, widened body kits, not a scrap of sound deadening, seam welds, competition brakes, rally handling setups and rollcages...what could they do. They're still slower than Corollas and boatier than the Titanic deep down inside, but they seem fairly nippy when they're in competition for mere Retnas. Guess we're all imagining things.

Interestingly enough NAC of all places specifically insure such failures of vehicles for damage and theft - they don't cover for damage during competition, but they sure as hell cover for damage outside that scenario.

And there are mighty 10-second WRXs out there, even STis that have been built to do this (insurable, I might add)... on the outside they embarrass some mighty machines, machines designed specifically for drag. They're barely street legal and about as highly-strung as they get. Of course, deep down inside they're just STis, or WRXs, certainly not designed for drag! Useless damn vehicles, certainly not good for the 10 seconds they clock up on the strip.

I guess that thread in the Stolen forum is relevant...go have a peek.

And in the meantime, I'll have to go research this theory about a car still being a slow turd no matter what goes into it. There's a perfect example going on in the states that I might just have to link. It's an Impreza L...1800cc FWD auto POS that's getting a complete roll cage, every useless bit of metal trimmed off, seamwelds from one end to the other and a 400hp Subaru motor. I'll have a close darn look and see what they trim out...maybe they'll find the fail and trim it out, so it can be fast like its 400hp motor says it will.

I mean heck, in theory I might do something stupid and drop that $15,000 race motor in and see what happens. It's not like I don't have an 800hp-proof box waiting for such a thing. Bet it'll still be slow though, and worth nothing (despite having a specifically GC8 chassis, the same one as the WRX and STi). If I was really, really retarded I could give it the dry-ice-and-hammer treatment, scrape out as much sealant as I could, have it sandblasted and seam welded, then donk a mortgage's worth of Whiteline/Cusco/Prodrive goodness into it and see what happens...will probably still be kak though. Worth absolutely nothing if I was blasphemous enough to simply strip it and drop a complete STi driveline into it from one end to another, register it as actually having a turbo in it, and consider it a WRX of sorts with every single STi part the book specifies. Still worth nothing, slow as hell. Certainly slower than the donor car ever was, with all the same gear.

Boy, that whole aura thing must be miiiiighty powerful.

IN FACT... perhaps we could unlock more power from vehicles by finding the fail, chopping it out...then we won't have to worry about shopping lists and VTEC stickers any more.

There's a sneaky scheme if ever I saw one.

Stay tuned... I might just have to add a slab of relevant links from other forums for the sake of a good read.

Oh. By the way.

Do that sh!t again and I'm hitting the report button. Seriously - there is absolutely no reason, in a civilised Western country, to behave like that. No reason at all. Other people can make their points clear without being vulgar and abusive...why can't you?

Im sorry i burst your little bubble, but you are adding many KGs from the 6 speed box and running gear, the brembos and the sub/amp you have(yes, i have read your drivel on other forums).

Plus you dont have many little extras like a seam welded chassis, or alloy lower arms. I could go on.

Your car will most likely be substantially heavier than a standard GC8 Sti, and even supposing you put in the SVX engine you are banging on(which will add more KGs) about wont be anywhere near as quick, and it wont handle as well.

Fact.

Your car is only worth what someone will pay for it. Fact.

The NAC(like any rational person) see that your car + x dollars of mods does not=whatever figure you seem to have plucked from thin air.

Im sorry im not trying to be mean, but please understand the insurance companies work on cold hard facts and no amount of emotion will make a difference to this. As any car enthusiast should know, the dollar value of mods you throw at your car does not necessarily add to the overall value of it.

Jammasta · April 22, 2009

I think my prems dropped by about 15% but my excess went down from 1500 to 350 for crash etc, and 1500 - 500 for theft.

SHALE, Maybe you could look at insuring the parts seperatly?

For example, including purchase of my car and what i've spent on it, i would get back roughly 1/2 if anything happened to it.

Its a bottomless pit that feels pointless at times.

D-Style · April 22, 2009

Ive been with most companies now. AMI, STATE, NAC, CLIC, the old CHINA insurance.

and the best one ive had out of all of them. A Broker!

Go see a broker. I went to state they wouldnt even let me finish telling them about my car before they said no. Went to a broker, and hello, state was the one who my policy was with. With my V9, we went with broker again, and CLIC was the one we went with cause we had an under 25 driver on the driver list. We did have to get it valued, which was that bad, as they are underwritten by ING.

Being over 25 doesnt do too much with a modified car. My excesses stayed the same and my overall cost came down only about $300. On my "standard" Blitzen with very minor mods, my execess stayed same but my premiums came fown from 1200 to 480 a year.

Shale · April 22, 2009

Rossmnz said:

Im sorry i burst your little bubble, but you are adding many KGs from the 6 speed box and running gear, the brembos and the sub/amp you have(yes, i have read your drivel on other forums).

Plus you dont have many little extras like a seam welded chassis, or alloy lower arms. I could go on.

Your car will most likely be substantially heavier than a standard GC8 Sti, and even supposing you put in the SVX engine you are banging on(which will add more KGs) about wont be anywhere near as quick, and it wont handle as well.

Fact.

Your car is only worth what someone will pay for it. Fact.

The NAC(like any rational person) see that your car + x dollars of mods does not=whatever figure you seem to have plucked from thin air.

Im sorry im not trying to be mean, but please understand the insurance companies work on cold hard facts and no amount of emotion will make a difference to this. As any car enthusiast should know, the dollar value of mods you throw at your car does not necessarily add to the overall value of it.

Right. The 'WHAT THE F**K' bits are highlighted bold.

1) 6MT, 'many' KGs. I take it you've lifted one of both, correct? In fact, you've lifted all three, right? Because I mean, that's the only way you can know the weight comparison.

It's not like I haven't lifted 2x manual gearboxes, 2x auto gearboxes, 1x tiptronic gearbox and 1x 6MT box, and it's not like I own FOUR of the above boxes or anything.

Let's go through this. For reference - I am female, 5'1", very small hands - things can be difficult to lift.

Auto gearboxes: the only thing I can do is put my hands around the back by the propshaft, and pull with all my weight. Even with a guy on the other end I can only get it a few inches off the ground for a few seconds before I drop it. BOTH boxes I am referring to had been drained of ATF, one of them still had diff fluid to sh!t all over me.

Tiptronic gearbox: I was expecting more of the same. However, in doing so, I almost decked myself in the face with the back of the box. They are LIGHT.

5MT gearboxes: more of the same. Absolutely no sweat. But we knew that, didn't we?

6MT gearbox: We had to carry it from the trailer to storage. Holding the rear of the box, I was actually able to assist mangling it all the way in. Sure it was heavy, but I didn't drop it in desperation in the same way as I did the autos.

Conclusion: Auto boxes are still significantly heavier. 6MTs are adding weight, but not remarkably much.

(Edit: my Impreza was once auto.)

2) Sub/amp. If you had've read the 'drivel' on 'other forums', you would already have realised that i) the amp was both blown and stolen, and ii) the sub is going in the WAGON.

Lurk moar.

3) Seam welded chassis. AFAIK this isn't exactly conducive to the crumple zones required for impact regulations, so I hardly think ANY STi is going to have that rather than the standard spot welding (correct me if I'm wrong though. Maybe the RA/Spec C models are special? Iunno). And if you lurked moar for once you'll find that I'm on an EJ20 in a GC8 chassis, which is spot welded just like any other 2.0L Subaru.

4) Alloy arms. Also, if you lurked harder, you'd find that's on my shopping list. WRXs don't have them either.

5) SVX engine. Why the hell would I put a big heavy EG33 in a small car like an Impreza? I have mentioned an SVX before, just once. In complimenting Nomake Wan's 1993 example in black, and its tidy condition. THAT IS IT. I don't know where you get half this rubbish...

6) Wait. Engines handle? This is new to me. I thought it was the suspension setup and chassis properties that did that part. AFAIK engines provide power. Maybe I was wrong? At any rate, the HX20s is rated at 1180kg from factory from what I understand. I didn't realise they made STis lighter than the RA's 1280kg. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that leaves me 100kg to play with before I hit the bottom end of the weight zone. Maybe my maths theory is wrong too?

Perhaps you should look around and see what people are actually selling modified cars for at present, and in the recent past. It's certainly not as low as you're implying, no matter the start chassis (though as far as I can tell, a GC8 is a GC8 once stripped of running gear, correct? Hence it not being a GC6 and lacking certain crossmembers, or lower and earning itself a whole pile of glue?).

How about you stop accusing me of 'driveling' and start actually pulling facts to the table, instead of doing what you're accusing me of yourself? Talk about the pot calling the kettle black!

Munkvy · April 22, 2009

Im with InsureDirect/Inbroke (same place). They have always been good to me, so I have stuck with them.

Im over 25 and pay $1000 a year in premiums, with an excess of $750 on theft. Ive lost my license twice before and park the car on the street (BG5 GTB) yet they keep dropping my premiums every year and dropped about $500 a year for when I turned 25 as well.

So I would have to recommend them as very reasonable to deal with.

Ohh and they were willing to insure my RS Legacy rallycar for about the same money - this is a car with cage, harnesses, seats, coilovers, different engine/turbo/intercooler/ECU etc.

Johnnynz · April 23, 2009

Shale']
[quote name='Rossmnz said:

Im sorry i burst your little bubble, but you are adding b]many[/b] KGs from the 6 speed box and running gear, the brembos and the sub/amp you have(yes, i have read your drivel on other forums).

Plus you dont have many little extras like a seam welded chassis, or alloy lower arms. I could go on.

Your car will most likely be substantially heavier than a standard GC8 Sti, and even supposing you put in the SVX engine you are banging on(which will add more KGs) about wont be anywhere near as quick, and it wont handle as well.

Fact.

Your car is only worth what someone will pay for it. Fact.

The NAC(like any rational person) see that your car + x dollars of mods does not=whatever figure you seem to have plucked from thin air.

Im sorry im not trying to be mean, but please understand the insurance companies work on cold hard facts and no amount of emotion will make a difference to this. As any car enthusiast should know, the dollar value of mods you throw at your car does not necessarily add to the overall value of it.