Front-mount on worked 1st-gen. Worth it

[wildturkey]

ahhh it's a great thread gota love it no reason why we can't debate the pros and cons of these things even if this subject has been thrashed before....lots of great info in here.........some strong opinions too........ but very little conclusive evidence either way. Think I'll stick with waic for now but keep an open mind to fmic

[Guest]

No no, Markmcrs,we both know that 380cc injectors can do 220kw atw, 440s can do 200 on half throttle at 0 base pressure, and VF23s at 16psi + a WAIC = 242kw atw

The law of physics doesn`t apply here

Oh, and here`s a dyno sheet of WAIC vs FMIC by adrianVOS IIRC. This means that 242kwatw with WAIC = ~300kwatw with FMIC

[kunchris]

sorry to resurrect the topic, my legacy BG is currently running a legacy WAIC setup on a ver6 STI longblock on a vf8 turbo pushing 1.3bar on fifth gear tapering to 1bar. did a top speed run to 260kph (gps) chasing my pal in his GTR r35. we did a stop over so that my oil temps cool down, they had reached 115degrees. water was at 98 degrees. after logging not much timing pulled,...and the intercooler water was just warm maybe cold to some people. i think it has some potential. but i think its cheaper and more reliable if your aiming at 350 400hp to the wheels , to go for a FMIC or a way bigger TMIC, unless you want to fabricate a bigger WAIC core and bigger radiator. as for me i prefer my WAIC to any classic top mount anyday. on a side note could anyone pull up the turbo specs and setup for the prodrive group A legacy?? it run WAIC right???...and was fast...right??? and had tonnes of boost right?? just a comparisson

[soopersubaru]

 BLSTIC said:

For the purposes of this conversation, worked includes 7.5:1 compression pistons, wrx heads, a 2.5" exhaust, cold-air intake, and an effectively free-boosted VF10.

I would hope to have maybe 230kw at the flywheel.

Is going to a large front-mounted intercooler going to have much effect at this level? Aside from adding toss factor of course (I'll probably paint it black anyway though).

Note that this does NOT mean that my new engine is built, just that I'm bored and thinking of what else I can do as well.

Thanks

Ben

Vf 10 will not give you the 230Kw you seek.(it cannot flow enough air)

The soopercooler setup (WAIC) will support over 250Kw with minimal lag

The standard WAIC will not flow enough air to support over 220Kw.

Recommend at least a VF22.

Then of course if you have not done other improvements to the engine internals it WILL blow to pieces!!

DO IT CORRECTLY to save some tears!!

[johnny5]

this thread is cool and entertaining and this is all I could think of

P.S I know nothing about WAIC's

[WRXONP]

Some one above was saying that even a engine built by god couldn't get 200 kw atw on 16 psi with vf23? i haves a dyno sheet showing 200kw at 16psi with my vf23.

Lol god himself is among us. ......

[johnny5]

 WRXONP said:

Some one above was saying that even a engine built by god couldn't get 200 kw atw on 16 psi with vf23? i haves a dyno sheet showing 200kw at 16psi with my vf23.

Lol god himself is among us. ......

yea bro I read that somewhere to but read some more i think someone claimed 240kw with a 23 now you gotta be god to get that

[WRXONP]

My latest print shows 235. . . Done work since then too. . . God mapped my computer lol

[CUDDAS]

how many people are willing to say that they are running the soopersubaru supercooler in here?

i think that a fmic is an option, but on a worked 1st gen then i'd definitely have one fitted, I'm pretty sure i'm not the only one who after a good trip/drive/thrash pop's the bonnet & puts a hand on & checks the temp differences between the I/C pipe's on both sides, & the cold side is always chilled so i am more than happy to keep my fmic to the point that i've even added one to my other bc5,

how many with those wiac setup's have done the same & felt it to be warm to hot?? that's not to say they arn't cool, it's a genuine Question for all who have checked

if you rally, hill climb sprint ect then maybe would look into a pwr waic system ect for the money

i think that if the soopercooler was tidied up it would appeal more.

[johnny5]

 WRXONP said:

My latest print shows 235. . . Done work since then too. . . God mapped my computer lol

throw it up bro

[Koom]

 kunchris said:

on a side note could anyone pull up the turbo specs and setup for the prodrive group A legacy?? it run WAIC right???...and was fast...right??? and had tonnes of boost right?? just a comparisson

Take one twenty litre tank of icy water, add to the intercooler radiator in every service park to cure the heat soak issues, then go make lots of power in a rally car.

[rex-leggy]

 johnny5']

[quote name='WRXONP said:

My latest print shows 235. . . Done work since then too. . . God mapped my computer lol

/quote]throw it up bro

ditto

[G-unit]

 WRXONP said:

Some one above was saying that even a engine built by god couldn't get 200 kw atw on 16 psi with vf23? i haves a dyno sheet showing 200kw at 16psi with my vf23.

Lol god himself is among us. ......

my last sti had 216kw on 16psi with vf23 had a zerosports ecu 2 help

[WRXONP]

Can't upload pics as i only have cell. There a pic nd the graph on my face book though lol. ..And i would never change my front mount. After a thrash and you stop and feel pipes the cold pipe is exactly that frikin cold. . Front mount feels frozen and quite importantly the intake manifold is cool. . A front mount Will keep air colder Than a top mount ever Will.

[Pappu1]

 johnny5']

[quote name='WRXONP said:

My latest print shows 235. . . Done work since then too. . . God mapped my computer lol

/quote]throw it up bro

+900

[DRFVDR]

From Brads FB page

[WRXONP]

lol thanks drf. surprised you could even find It ? paper says 233.7 . this was with external wastegate venting As well . . seems faster with new wastegate set up . . . . but any way . . you guys need to stop thinking only about turbo and what boost to make power . . . there's a whole lot more to think about when trying to achieve more kw at the wheels (Hint hint). . . .

[Pappu1]

damm nice!!!!

when was this dyno done brad?

after the one we had at TP?

whats the deal with uncorrected power vs corrected? anyone?

all the printed graphs i seen say corrected??

[WRXONP]

yeah afterwards . . . the correction factor allows for the changes in atmospheric pressure etc . . . all i can say is all the small things add up one at a time . . .

[Pappu1]

 WRXONP said:

yeah afterwards . . . the correction factor allows for the changes in atmospheric pressure etc . . . all i can say is all the small things add up one at a time . . .

235kw for a vf23/stock ecu has to be a record of some sort mate!!!!!!

[Jammasta]

Post up your 1/4 times. That's the true reflection of your cars pace.

[Pappu1]

 TURTLE said:

Post up your 1/4 times. That's the true reflection of your cars pace.

unless u a slow driver like me....

same car, same night .. i did a 13.1 and my brother in law did a 12.7 lol

(altho was many years back...)

u possibly meaning trap speed perhaps?

in any case back to back runs on the same dyno is whats the point isint it?

he did a 215 and now a 235..

i only see that as a major improvement ....

[WRXONP]

quarter mile times will come . . but since My car is My daily driver It won't be all that soon . . . Im just playing around with this engine . trying different set ups . . seeing what works and what doesn't . . this is all with a non opened ej20g as well ! My new motor build is about to start . will be fully forged . big cams . baffled sump and Gt3540 . . . when i hit the strip i will have a spare gear box to throw in but aiming for 300kw and low 11s from a daily driver ! wouldn't take It there now as i would brake something and have no daily driver

[boon]

 WRXONP said:

lol thanks drf. surprised you could even find It ? paper says 233.7 . this was with external wastegate venting As well . . seems faster with new wastegate set up . . . . but any way . . you guys need to stop thinking only about turbo and what boost to make power . . . there's a whole lot more to think about when trying to achieve more kw at the wheels (Hint hint). . . .

That's a helluva lot of power from that setup. What injectors are you running, and which dyno was it on?

I'm aiming for similar power levels from my V7.

Oh and just to keep it on-topic... I'm staying TMIC, got myself a Process West one on the way. For road driving tbh it's going to cool just as well as a FMIC for sub-250wkw and even if it only lags slightly less than a FMIC, that's still less, and my entire modification path has been about increasing spool, early power and torque.

[WRXONP]

yellow injectors still . 6s ecu . . . torque performance rolling road dyno . . . . front mount piping doesn't add that much to turbo spool time . . . but its whether or not you want to sacrifice the tiny amount of lost spool time for more dense air meaning more power